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Old 10-06-2014, 04:39 PM
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Default Hook up to land ratio?

Hello,

New to the board. I've been fishing Marlin locally since 2006. After some great advise from Mr. Lassley, my son and I starting catching Marlin on a more regular basis. This week we fished three days and had 10 solid hookups and landed only two fish! It was very discouraging as the fish would fall off after an intial run. They would usually spit the jig while jumping. Although we have lost our fair share of fish over the years, we have never had such a poor ratio. My normal selection is; one or two Coggins peanuts, a small Joe Yee plunger, a MM Baby Ruckus, a mini 1656, and an EAL in tight. The lures are rigged with either a single Jobu or 7761. The leader is either 150 or 200lb.
Does this seem like a high loss ratio? Is there any techniques that help the fish stayed pinned? We haven't experienced this issue in the past, and as you can expect, it is very frustrating! Any advise would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Erik on the Triple Play.

Last edited by Tripleplay; 10-06-2014 at 04:57 PM.
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Old 10-06-2014, 05:10 PM
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Default Re: Hook up to land ratio?

Your description doesn't sound significantly different that the way I rig, so I doubt that's the issue. To me, there is nothing as scary as when a hot striped marlin starts greyhounding across the horizon - you are really at their mercy, and I've lost a lot of them during that phase.

The two things I can recommend to help decrease losing them while jumping is to have a really sharp hook and maintain a solid pressure. Often, the hook won't have dug into the marlin deep enough to stay there by itself, and the combination of a good sharp hook and constant pressure will at least keep it pinned to the fish until they settle down.

Prayer doesn't hurt, either ...
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Old 10-06-2014, 08:21 PM
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Default Re: Hook up to land ratio?

Use a 8/0 size - #7691S Mustad (file down the barb 1/2) or Bart hook (fish out of the package). These are both Southern Tuna shape which will grab and stay put in the corner of the jaw or even wrap and wedge on the bill (a smaller or larger size won't on stripers like an 8/0) . The Jobu is a open style thick designed bait hook - not a good trolling lure hook. Your hook up ratio will be lower with them.

Can you take a picture of your rigging? Single hook? What are you using to space the hook from the back of the lure head and where is the hook point in relation to the lure skirt (photo best).

What type of outriggers are you using?

What type of outrigger clip and setting of the clip?

What breaking strength is your drag setting on the reels?

What line lb. are you pulling your lures with?

What is your reel and boat procedure on a lure strike?

Lots of components involved that determine your hook to land ratio with lures.

When all else fails or you want to get a 80% or better hook up ratio and take advantage of every fish you raise here - skip pulling armed lures and store them. Instead, go with 4 select size ballyhoo rigged with 1/2 oz. to 3/4 oz. egg sinkers on their chins paired with a 8/0 L2004 Eagle Claw circle hook. Fish two ballyhoo long off your riggers with Black's clips and two pegged down close off the transom with Black's clips near your bridge teasers. Bridge teasers would be a 6 - 9" Moldcraft squid chain teaser (green or red or blue) with a black softhead carrying a ballyhoo under the head.

Use your lures to cover ground and once you find fish or are in your zone with bait and waiting on a tide change for the fish to show boxing the area - go bait and teasers.

Dave
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Old 10-07-2014, 06:45 AM
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Default Re: Hook up to land ratio?

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Brackmann View Post
Use a 8/0 size - #7691S Mustad (file down the barb 1/2) or Bart hook (fish out of the package). These are both Southern Tuna shape which will grab and stay put in the corner of the jaw or even wrap and wedge on the bill (a smaller or larger size won't on stripers like an 8/0) . The Jobu is a open style thick designed bait hook - not a good trolling lure hook. Your hook up ratio will be lower with them.

Can you take a picture of your rigging? Single hook? What are you using to space the hook from the back of the lure head and where is the hook point in relation to the lure skirt (photo best). Single hook, black rubber stopper at head,beads, double crimp. The hook is flush with the skirt.

What type of outriggers are you using? Rupp triple spreader

What type of outrigger clip and setting of the clip? Blacks and Aftco

What breaking strength is your drag setting on the reels? 15-17lb of drag.

What line lb. are you pulling your lures with? 100lb Izor smoke.

What is your reel and boat procedure on a lure strike? Acceleration at strike, one man on rod with fish, the others clear.

Lots of components involved that determine your hook to land ratio with lures.

When all else fails or you want to get a 80% or better hook up ratio and take advantage of every fish you raise here - skip pulling armed lures and store them. Instead, go with 4 select size ballyhoo rigged with 1/2 oz. to 3/4 oz. egg sinkers on their chins paired with a 8/0 L2004 Eagle Claw circle hook. Fish two ballyhoo long off your riggers with Black's clips and two pegged down close off the transom with Black's clips near your bridge teasers. Bridge teasers would be a 6 - 9" Moldcraft squid chain teaser (green or red or blue) with a black softhead carrying a ballyhoo under the head.

Use your lures to cover ground and once you find fish or are in your zone with bait and waiting on a tide change for the fish to show boxing the area - go bait and teasers.

Dave
Thanks for the reply, that is some great information. Where can I buy rigged Ballyhoo? I have two Tropic Star Daisy chains that Lassley instructed me to buy. Should I put a non rigged chase bait behind them and run them short?
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Old 10-07-2014, 10:05 AM
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Default Re: Hook up to land ratio?

Can you take a picture of your rigging? Single hook? What are you using to space the hook from the back of the lure head and where is the hook point in relation to the lure skirt (photo best). "Single hook, black rubber stopper at head,beads, double crimp. The hook is flush with the skirt."

Don't use beads as a spacer from the lure head to the hook. A marlin bites down on the lure behind the head and the thick beads do not allow the hook to slide in the marlin's mouth to allow the hook to set firmly in the jaw. Instead either double twist the leader or make your spacing with 600 lb. smooth cable or best use a piece of Teflon tubing over your leader as a spacer. Hook eye to non-swinging in the rigging. Use tape with mono or tube to secure the hook or with cable use clear shrink tube a the hook eye connection point. Think wahoo - you want to be able to let the hook slide into the jaw. The point of the hook should be just even with the end of the skirt to still be legal yet spaced back as far as possible. You want distance between the lure head and hook to allow the fish to pinch down on just the skirt and thin / smooth spacer and then pull the hook into the jaw hinge.

Rupps or aluminum poles will produce a higher hook up rate as they produce a crisp release from the clip versus fiberglass outriggers which flex and delay a crisp release. Add block pulleys to your Rupps and if you had glass riggers do the same.


Aftco old style clips are great with lures, especially on stripers when run and gun fishing and ability to reel the lures away to tease a fish to get a more aggressive bite and or to clear a lure to switch the fish to a drop back bait. Ideally you want to avoid a lure bite and get a bait bite as baits bites result in a higher hook conversion ratio over lures. Set the clip just tight enough to hold the lure in place. Blacks clips are great with ballyhoo up here or when used with a dacron loop and tag line when fishing blues.

100 lb. is heavy for stripers and your hook up rate will be better with say 30 - 50 lb. line.

Try 30 lb. with 5 lbs. of drag or 50 lb. with about 7 - 10 lbs. of drag instead.

You want the marlin to grab the lure with a crisp release to allow the fish a second to turn away from the boat or at least sink out to change the angle from the rod tip to the hook so that the hook rig can pull across and through the top and bottom bills and get to the soft spot in the top of the mouth or best corner loop of the jaw. Then, increase the drag pressure to 30 - 50% for a few seconds as the fish is facing away to drive the hook in and then back off if the fish starts jumping on the surface - staying tight with no slack. Turning the boat to the opposite side of the bite helps angle the line away from the fish and also helps add a little belly in the line below the surface which helps on the tension to the hook and also angle to the fish. There is no benefit in accelerating directly away from the fish on a bite in a straight line. Once the fish settles down, work back on the line to the fish and or forward when needed to plane the fish back up. If your backing down and the fish sulks, change directions and try pulling on the fish at different angles as it will move the fish as the leader runs along the fish's body. Alternatively, try backing off the drag and create a belly of line behind the fish as the belly of line will force the fish's head to pull towards the surface, whereby you can back down and pick up a lot of line and have the fish up on top for a fast back down to grab leader, then go forward turning the fish's head to leader up and release.

Dave Brackmann
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Old 10-07-2014, 11:08 AM
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Default Re: Hook up to land ratio?

Wow, that is great information! As embarassing as it might be, I am attaching some photos of my rigging. This Coggins does have 5 fish to it's credit though.
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File Type: jpg IMG_1936.jpg (47.1 KB, 50 views)
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File Type: jpg B's Marlin.jpg (122.6 KB, 34 views)
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Old 10-07-2014, 11:15 AM
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Default Re: Hook up to land ratio?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripleplay View Post
Wow, that is great information! As embarassing as it might be, I am attaching some photos of my rigging. This Coggins does have 5 fish to it's credit though.
Trust me - I've run this place for 15 years and I still learn something every time one of our experts post. And remember, the only thing more embarrassing than asking for help is not asking ...
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Old 10-07-2014, 11:28 AM
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Default Re: Hook up to land ratio?

Erick, the single hook rig you show on your picture is what many call a "broken elbows" rig... not my favorite and I bet not Dave's or Stan's either. Use a semi stiff rig and if you really want to better your odds put a second hook on lures 12" and above
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Old 10-07-2014, 11:52 AM
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Default Re: Hook up to land ratio?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripleplay View Post
Wow, that is great information! As embarassing as it might be, I am attaching some photos of my rigging. This Coggins does have 5 fish to it's credit though.
Nice boat and riggers!

First, the stopper needs to be epoxy glued to the back of the lure head. Ditch the beads! To make a twisted mono spacer rig, step one run the leader thru the hook eye 2X. Then slide on a crimp and swage so the leader is tight to the hook eye. Next slide on another crimp. Then twist the leader so that the spacing puts the tip of the hook even with the end of the lure skirt and the lead crimp fits into the back of the stopper. Now swage the lead crimp in place. Last use red electrical tape (makes it easy to see where the hook is in a fish while fighting them) and tape the hook crimp down to past the hook eye and back up and use super glue to bind the tape. Or use semi-ridge Teflon tube as a spacer (super slick and no bend like twisted mono can be) or a cable rig (strong and slick).

Good luck Eric and let me know if I can help.

Dave
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Old 10-07-2014, 12:03 PM
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Default Re: Hook up to land ratio?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PacoSaca View Post
Erick, the single hook rig you show on your picture is what many call a "broken elbows" rig... not my favorite and I bet not Dave's or Stan's either. Use a semi stiff rig and if you really want to better your odds put a second hook on lures 12" and above


I agree with Paco. See the Bart hook and cable rig on the bottom (he sells the too) - works great. On and for stripers with lures under 12" and under, use only one hook. You will have a higher hook up ratio and your lures will swim better. You will get a higher hook up ratio on stripers with a lure in the 9" - 11" range than a larger lure most of the time. Or just pull larger hook less teasers and catch almost everyone of them on bait. Hard to beat teasers (squid chains and dredges) and ballyhoo on stripers if you really want to catch numbers and fully take advantage of every fish you raise. Personally a lot more fun way to fish too.

I find I get a higher hook up ratio with a single hook over a double hook rig on all size lures. The lures swim better = more bites, no skirts tangling with a lead hook, less damage to a marlin I am releasing and by far a lot less dangerous in releasing fish boat side. Exception can be days on blue marlin slapping at large short corner baits where a front lead hook up against the lure head can help on a lure run off the rod tip or close short rigger position.


Dave

Last edited by David Brackmann; 10-07-2014 at 12:05 PM. Reason: typo
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